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Removal of front suspention lower ball joint on alfa 33

 
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Bobkelso
Alfa Sprint


Joined: 09 Aug 2011
Posts: 190
Location: Milan - Italy

PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 7:29 pm    Post subject: Removal of front suspention lower ball joint on alfa 33 Reply with quote

Hi, I have I question,
when disassembling the front suspension
I'd like disassemble also the lower ball joint from hub,
if not it is easy that moving the parts around
(or working on the car) the lower arm
and the hub get an excessive angle and the rubber seal ("L" in the photo)
of the ball joint get pinched/cutted (after that you have to change it)
and you know if the ball joint is the original it is connected
to the arm by 3 rivets ("H" in the photo) and not by the 3 removable
bolts you put with a spare ball joint.

So, how did you detach the conic shaped axis of the ball joint from the hub?
I usually unscrew a bit the secure nut ("B" in the photo)
put some svitol spray and after some time I use the hammer
on the lower arm until axis separated from hub,
but if it get hard to remove may be I'm damaging the ball joint..

Have you a better way ? ..hammer, leverages or other.. 'Shocked'
I put some marks on the photo if you have some indications..
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/280x200q90/537/rULRat.jpg

Ps.: sorry if the image is low quality, I see now imageshack
is no more permitting to post full images for free..

Ok..here the photo full scale:
http://i.imgur.com/bLTi484.jpg
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BigAl
P4


Joined: 06 May 2003
Posts: 2990
Location: U.K Surrey

PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 7:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Bobkelso
Have a look at page 10 of this
http://www.alfa-restoration.co.uk/manuals/Suspension_steering_trans/Front_suspension.pdf

if you damage the ball joint boot, you can replace just that and not the whole arm. Or you can buy a ball joint boot repair kit.
eg
http://www.balljointboots.co.uk/
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Bobkelso
Alfa Sprint


Joined: 09 Aug 2011
Posts: 190
Location: Milan - Italy

PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 8:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi BigAl,
I tried as in the (very good) manual you linked
but last time I was not able to find good leverage points
or get enough time with hammering the hub,
may be it is easy and I was I bit in a hurry
(never a good mood for work on the car)

I ll' appreciate any suggestion.

Thank for the link to balljointboots Very Happy ,
somebody have already tried them?
It seems a good idea to have some spare boots,
as buy a couple of lower TWR ball joint
every time some boots was pinched by me
or the mechanic was not a good deal..
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mg907
Alfasud


Joined: 12 Dec 2011
Posts: 38
Location: Italy

PostPosted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bobkelso wrote:
Hi BigAl,
I tried as in the (very good) manual you linked
but last time I was not able to find good leverage points
or get enough time with hammering the hub,
may be it is easy and I was I bit in a hurry
(never a good mood for work on the car)

I ll' appreciate any suggestion.

Thank for the link to balljointboots Very Happy ,
somebody have already tried them?
It seems a good idea to have some spare boots,
as buy a couple of lower TWR ball joint
every time some boots was pinched by me
or the mechanic was not a good deal..


Hi Bobkelso,
I hope you have got in your toolbox a ball-joint extractor, if not, it worths the money you will spend for it. It is not too expensive, you can buy it on ebay if it is more convenient for you, and you can get rid of hammers and leverages.



When you will reassemble the ball joint again do not forget to spread a little of grease in the slightly conical part (just under the threaded end) to make the next disassembling easier.

Mario
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Bobkelso
Alfa Sprint


Joined: 09 Aug 2011
Posts: 190
Location: Milan - Italy

PostPosted: Tue Aug 19, 2014 7:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Mario,
thanks, yes I use a ball-joint extractor for the upper (steering) joint,
very effective, but for the lower suspension ball-joint in the case of alfa 33
I was not able to use extractor unless I dismantle also the wheel axis "A"
from hub to get clearance..you see in the photo between part
"A" and B" there are very few millimeters, not easy get in the
extractor (or may be not possible at all?), and if you can to
use an extractor, the "B" nut is an obstacle, you can unscrew
it only a bit and you cannot apply force directly on the ball-joint axis
but only in the upper part of the nut , that is very thin and weak;

I think I have to learn the right trick to apply a good leverage when hammering
(I put some letters on photo hoping in some detailed suggestions Wink).

Good idea spread a little of grease during reassemble,
simple but still now I have not done it for that joint.. Rolling Eyes
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eagle3
Alfa 33


Joined: 11 Nov 2007
Posts: 402
Location: France

PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 6:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You have to unscrew the nut with the weight of the car on the wheels.

Then with the car on an axle stand use a crow bar to lever/push the arm down to free the ball joint from the hub. Er I think. Very Happy
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ZeNiTh-PbArM
Alfa 33


Joined: 14 Mar 2003
Posts: 388
Location: Paris, France

PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2014 7:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi,

This is not a complicated job.
You only need to remove the driveshaft.
Once this is done you remove the bolt attaching the front suspension arm to the front crossmember and the bolt attaching the rear suspension arm to the chassis.
Then the lower triangle will only be attached to the strut through the ball joint. You can tilt it enough that you can get a puller inbetween and extract the ball joint without damage to any part.

regards,
zp

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Bobkelso
Alfa Sprint


Joined: 09 Aug 2011
Posts: 190
Location: Milan - Italy

PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2014 3:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi eagle3,
Hi ZeNiTh-PbArM,
thanks, ok so:

- the secure way is removing the drive-shaft,
in practice it could be convenient planning
to do a complete revision of front train..

Ps.: probably you already know, if the suspension
is already dismantled, the nut of the drive-shaft
could be unscrew easily using a pneumatic-screwer
(I haven't one but my mechanic has it)

- if I try without removing the drive-shaft,
to do a good leverage while hammering,
probably I should have not removed
the front suspension arm, because it helps
to avoid the main suspension arm
(the one with the ball-joint) to rotate
when i search to apply leverage,
and I have to use a bigger tool

Ps.: still I'm not sure this method will do the job
is the axis joint is very old/oxidized (i.e. car remained
always outside for 20 years with original ball-joint)..
Somebody else have success with this method?
Because If I get convinced it (almost) works, probably
another time I can try with more diligence and patience Shocked
(may be also some ear plugs will help)

What about:

- drill the 3 rivets and separate the ball-joint from the arm,
putting 3 removable (the correct hi tensile type) bullets
at the first time I work on suspension also
if I'm not changing the original ball-joint from alfa

- unscrew the "B" nut a bit and move/scroll a bit the car still
with the wheels on the ground, using his mass to apply force
(probably not enough to obtain something?)

- leave the ball-joint and hub connected but thinking some simple
locking device to avoid hub and arm could angle so much
to punch the ball-joint boot..
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eagle3
Alfa 33


Joined: 11 Nov 2007
Posts: 402
Location: France

PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2014 4:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It would be easier putting it back on the car I think..
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