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Alfa 33 1.5L, Bleeding the clutch??

 
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alferr
Alfasud


Joined: 02 May 2003
Posts: 76
Location: ausrtralia, south australia

PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 10:37 am    Post subject: Alfa 33 1.5L, Bleeding the clutch?? Reply with quote

Hi guys i havent had to bleed a hydrolic clutch system before how is it done on an alfa 33??

thanks in advance!
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john 33_16v
16 Valve


Joined: 27 May 2005
Posts: 1406
Location: herts, uk

PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 10:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bleed screw is on clutch slave top left hand side of engine.

Use normal method with an assistant, tube and jamjar.

Slaves are a known weak point so check it isn't leaking. Replacement is a b*tch i'm afraid- fiddy circlip.

John
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alferr
Alfasud


Joined: 02 May 2003
Posts: 76
Location: ausrtralia, south australia

PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 12:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok well, i tried bleeding from that nipple and it didnt do anything, there is a winding noise wen i engage the clutch whilest the car is on??

Car wont go in gear without crunching even with my foot flat on the clutch, so wats the other way to bleed the system?
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john 33_16v
16 Valve


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Location: herts, uk

PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 12:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You need to try and see if the clutch slave cylinder is working with the clutch pressed down- i.e moving the clutch fork. If not the slave is probably caput.

If the fork does move then your clutch is probably caput. If it's making a noise when the pedal is pressed it's likely the bearing is shot, and thus not disengaging the clutch.

John
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alferr
Alfasud


Joined: 02 May 2003
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Location: ausrtralia, south australia

PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 12:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hmm is that why wen i push the car in gear the flywheel doesnt move, and the car moves forward???
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gritsop
Green Cloverleaf


Joined: 23 Apr 2003
Posts: 766
Location: Ekali, Athens - Greece

PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 12:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi,

Alfa 33 clutch system comprises of two cylinders. The master one right next to the servo brake and the slave located at the bellhousing of the gearbox.

Clutch hydraulics are bleeded out at the slave cylinder as you described. In my 33 I have had both cylinders replaced almost at the same time as both leaked badly. However the new master cylinder gave up the ghost within two months as the internals were heavily worn out and the metal parts scratched the bore.

Result: pressing the clutch pedal all way down could build up pressure to disengage clutch only for a few seconds...Pressure then dropped and within 20-30 seconds the clutch fork would return to its rest position thus engaging the gear selected even if you still had the pedal fully pressed Shocked It may sound strange but it was reality.

An indication was black brake fluid returning to the brake fluid tank from the master cylinder. This black fluid was the result of the rubber seals melting ... Rolling Eyes

Do check the possibility that your cylinder leaks or cannot hold up pressure. An easy test is to have an assistant fully press the clutch pedal and you watching the fork travel; this will reveal whats going on.

Hope this helps,
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eagle3
Alfa 33


Joined: 11 Nov 2007
Posts: 402
Location: France

PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2007 9:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sounds like the slave cylinder is seized with the clutch disengaged with worn disk and a tired cage or a combination of all three.
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alferr
Alfasud


Joined: 02 May 2003
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Location: ausrtralia, south australia

PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2007 11:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The fork seems to be working fine, just not building much pressure.

Im not sure why there is that wining noise on idle it starts to go away arfter a while, but if the clutch pedal is out to the floor it gets louder, then not so loud when pedal is realesed.

The fact that when i was trying to put the car at TDC, i put the car in gear and noticed that when pushing the car forward that the flywheel didnt move, yes it was hard to push but the flywheel didnt move at all sounded like something was slipping?? Is this just caused because the hydrolic system hasnt been bled properly?? I did swap the whole Clutch operating cylinder that attaches to the block slave cylinder im assuiming...
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alferr
Alfasud


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Location: ausrtralia, south australia

PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2007 5:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Any ideas guys??
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eagle3
Alfa 33


Joined: 11 Nov 2007
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Location: France

PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2007 10:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If the fork is moving when you press the pedal either the clutch disk is worn down to nothing or is stuck in the disengaged position. You're going to have to have a look at the clutch mechanism I'm afraid.
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paulhide
P4


Joined: 20 Dec 2003
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Location: Oh Beautiful Billingham

PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2007 1:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Could be the thrust bearing being pushed through the clutch plate splines, which means new clutch Question
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bobbber
P4


Joined: 14 May 2003
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Location: The Greatest Town on Earth - Swadlincote, UK

PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2007 3:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just as an aside.... anyone thinking of bleeding anything should consider one of these vacuum kits (Draper VAC1A) :





It makes my life 1000000% easier... I thought initially how it was going to be occasionally useful, but it's actually something I use often.

It makes it easy to bleed brakes, clutch etc... and also to drain fluid from places. Also has a vacuum meter on it for testing leaks.

Bob Cool
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john 33_16v
16 Valve


Joined: 27 May 2005
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Location: herts, uk

PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2007 4:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bobbber can this be used to kinda suck from the bleed nipples? -oh er mrs

It looks better than the awful Eezi bleed kits you used to get which connected to a tyre for pressure. In theory a good idea, but in practice you had to put about a pint of fluid in the bottle, and the cap never fitted the resovoirs properly so you just sprayed a pint of fluid at pressure all over the engine bay Rolling Eyes

John
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bobbber
P4


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2007 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

john 33_16v wrote:
In theory a good idea, but in practice you had to put about a pint of fluid in the bottle, and the cap never fitted the resovoirs properly so you just sprayed a pint of fluid at pressure all over the engine bay Rolling Eyes


Sounds ok.... great way to strip the engine bay ready for a coat of POR15! Laughing

Bob Cool
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Admin
Site Admin


Joined: 19 Feb 2003
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Location: Stafford, UK

PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 12:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi

Just looks like a copy of the Mity Vac setups. Use one for bleeding the brakes on the bikes.

All the best

Keith
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alferr
Alfasud


Joined: 02 May 2003
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Location: ausrtralia, south australia

PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 1:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

yes that looks like a good idea, well problem fixed was a broken thrust bearing, now all good Smile

thanks for the info guys!
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Scott Sander
Alfa 33


Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 419
Location: Sydney, Australia

PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 1:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My 16V did that earlier I the year, looks like it is catching. The comment from the mechanic was he didn't know how I got it to his shop, it was that bad. Still have the old plate, should take some piccies.
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