| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Scott Sander
Alfa 33
Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 419
Location: Sydney, Australia
|
 Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2003 4:23 am Post subject: Seat belts |
 |
|
Hi,
Does anyone know who originally manufactured or an after market manufacturer that make the front seat belts for my Alfa 33 16V?
I thought it was Klippan, but they seem reluctant to admit it.
I need to replace them as the drivers side inertia reel is not behaving itself.
You can't legally buy 2nd hand seatbelts in OZ, as far as I am aware.
_________________
Scott Sander
'91 Alfa 33 Boxer 16V Monza - Awesome
http://www.sanderfamily.com |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Hamish Brown
Alfa Arna
Joined: 03 Jun 2003
Posts: 21
Location: NSW AUSTRALIA
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2003 7:43 am Post subject: seat belt drama |
|
|
Hey Scott
If you can get some good second hand ones from someone and you think that they are safe why not use them its not as if the cops are going to pull u over and say HEY THOSE SELT BELTS DONT LOOK LIKE THE ONES THAT CAME IN THIS CAR. Just a thought thats all.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Chris Notsis
Alfasud
Joined: 21 Mar 2003
Posts: 62
Location: Melbourne, Australia
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2003 8:08 am Post subject: seat belts |
|
|
Scott,
Try Hemco at: < www.hemco.com.au > (based in Melbourne).
As an engineer working in brakes and brake-related safety systems, I would NOT recommend 2nd hand units, especially for the driver! Either find an OEM replacement or replace the complete assembly (floor mount, and reel assembly) with a reputable after-market product. Second hand units may LOOK a-ok, but the weave of the belt may have been stressed in a collision but not enough to show shears and witness marks at the stitched ends. I have seen too many 2nd hand units in this situation. I'm actually an advocate of the banning of sale of 2nd hand units, especially through markets and wreckers (re-cyclers).
In the end, it has nothing to do with cops and what they do and do not say.
Cheers
Chris.
_________________
Chris Notsis |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Gary UK
Alfa Sprint
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
Posts: 218
Location: Darlington UK
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2003 8:25 am Post subject: |
|
|
| I use seat belts from a sud tied together as a tow rope and have used the same ones for about eight years, they have seen alot of action and have never snapped. I'd source a decent second hand one myself |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Hamish Brown
Alfa Arna
Joined: 03 Jun 2003
Posts: 21
Location: NSW AUSTRALIA
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2003 8:33 am Post subject: seat belts |
|
|
Hello Chris
I didnt mean buy some out of a wright off but if you found a set out of a car that was being wrecked because the engine ect was u/s then what is the differance between using those and fitting them to your car and buying the car and replacing the engine and using the same seat belts and when you go for your roadworthy they dont send the seat belts off for load testing do they? And it was just a suggestion if scott couldnt find new ones. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Scott Sander
Alfa 33
Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 419
Location: Sydney, Australia
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2003 9:01 am Post subject: |
|
|
Hi,
Thanks Chris. I am not going to use 2nd hand, too many unknowns. Then again you can buy 2nd hand cars so they would have 2nd hand belts. I have seen some shocking examples of belts in my search for another 16V also.
The belts for a 16V mount onto the seat for the clasp, unlike my series 1 that mounted onto the floor. Klippan did admit they do both types.
I spoke to a guy who was supposed to be an engineer there, must admit he seemed to know his stuff, so we will call him an engineer. He said I need to check a few things, which I have done. Will speak to him again tomorrow. Hopefully he can give me part numbers to order.
The belts I was sold are totally the wrong ones. They don't even have the right type of mounting for the reel. They mount into the B pillar instead of on the B pillar.
_________________
Scott Sander
'91 Alfa 33 Boxer 16V Monza - Awesome
http://www.sanderfamily.com |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Sergio
Alfa Sprint
Joined: 13 Mar 2003
Posts: 150
Location: Portugal
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2003 9:23 am Post subject: |
|
|
Hi Scott,
I've gone and checked my Belts. Their brand is Sabelt, A well known seatbelt brand (competion belts).
All the best
Sérgio |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Chris Notsis
Alfasud
Joined: 21 Mar 2003
Posts: 62
Location: Melbourne, Australia
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2003 12:58 pm Post subject: tow rope belts! |
|
|
| Gary UK wrote: |
| I use seat belts from a sud tied together as a tow rope and have used the same ones for about eight years, they have seen alot of action and have never snapped. I'd source a decent second hand one myself |
Sorry to harp on this; I don't mean to make an issue of it, but... Towing a static weight like a car is a little different from restraining a human body decellerating at a rate of 4.5 g (4.5 times the force of gravity) over a distance of about 15 cm (the degree of stretch in the average belt with an 80kg adult body hitting it while the car is braking at 100 km/h) as the vehicle collides with another object (wall or car). Put it another way - an equivalent force would be when dropping out of a 3rd story window but multiply this force by 4.5; ultimately it's not the fall that hurts - only the sudden stop!
The other thing is that seat belts used as tow ropes are ok since their shear rate (the point at which they will tear) is distributed over a much longer distance (like 5 metres) as opposed to the triangulated energy distribution of an installed seat belt which has a limited but high shear strength. Most new belts will cope with 5.5 - 6g (with belt pre-tensioners etc this rating actually increases). Belts from the 80s and 90s tend to cope with 5 - 5.5 g. If they have been stressed (ie used in a collision) then this rating drops and therefore their ability to do their job reliably is thrown into great doubt.
Chris.
_________________
Chris Notsis |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Admin
Site Admin
Joined: 19 Feb 2003
Posts: 1223
Location: Stafford, UK
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2003 4:45 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Hi
My understanding is that a belt in a collision has a small amount of give to reduce the severity of the decelleration. Once used once they stretch and will not have any give in the future (like a motorcycle crash helmet lining).
I would not worry about using 2nd hand belts IF I knew where they came from and what condition they were in. If they were from a crashed car then I wouldn't touch them.
What is the problem with the belt? Can it have a new belt fitted to the existing mechanism?
All the best
Keith |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Adam H
Alfasud
Joined: 07 May 2003
Posts: 92
Location: Portsmouth, UK
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2003 6:46 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Hi
I spent 5 years working for Autoliv companies (Seatbelts, pyro buckles, airbags) and would recommend no one fits used seatbelts from a crashed vehicle.
It really is worth selling your soul (And your credit card) to replace the belt assembly if the retractor is dodgy as it is your life on the end of the reel! (Or grabber)
Go to Alfa and order a new one - they will get you the right one for the right year - they will carry a warranty, the webbing will stretch correctly for the crash pulse of your 33 and it MIGHT even match the rest of the belts in your car.
You'll find it works correctly, locks at the right angle, the right g and will probably save your life.
Spend!
Adam H |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Scott Sander
Alfa 33
Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 419
Location: Sydney, Australia
|
| Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2003 9:47 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Hi,
I have already spoken to Alfa. They don't have the part number on their system anymore, i.e. they don't have any stock.
It is the driver’s side retractor that is the problem. The webbing appears to be in excellent condition, no fraying at all.
These belts I was sold do have the correct tongue and the B pillar top ring, they look exactly the same as original.
It's just the retractor is around the wrong way, they angle for the retractor is wrong and the stalk length is wrong.
_________________
Scott Sander
'91 Alfa 33 Boxer 16V Monza - Awesome
http://www.sanderfamily.com |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2003 2:16 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Scott Sander wrote: |
Hi,
I have already spoken to Alfa. They don't have the part number on their system anymore, i.e. they don't have any stock.
It is the driver’s side retractor that is the problem. The webbing appears to be in excellent condition, no fraying at all.
These belts I was sold do have the correct tongue and the B pillar top ring, they look exactly the same as original.
It's just the retractor is around the wrong way, they angle for the retractor is wrong and the stalk length is wrong. |
Scott - bite the bullet and replace the whole assembly. Make no mods and short cuts!
Chris. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Scott Sander
Alfa 33
Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 419
Location: Sydney, Australia
|
| Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2003 3:06 am Post subject: |
|
|
Hi,
I am trying to replace the whole assembly. If I can find someone who will supply me new front seat belts I will fit them. I'm not trying to make any short cuts, as you can see I have already ruled out 2nd hand.
I would prefer them to be a retail item rather than custom made and tested. I will provide more info on the custom made later if that is the only option.
_________________
Scott Sander
'91 Alfa 33 Boxer 16V Monza - Awesome
http://www.sanderfamily.com |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
