Alfa Pages

[alfistjen]

Pretty pissed today,

was driving my 16V today, sporty but totaly not racing it's ass off. Just before driving on a roundabout the engine seized (came from +- 3000 rpm) and I heared a 'flappering' - 'clappering' sound. Bit like an exhaust joint that leaks and clappers but much louder. First thought: cambelt is out so clutch in and let roll till parking reached. Hoping to find the alternator belt in pieces I found the LHS cambelt partially cut through the plastic cover. I didn't start the car anymore but as it seized while driving I expect the worst. Shit of the story is that I bought the car 2500 km ago from the garage and they changed the belts 500 km before that, so they were brand new. Now they come up with the story of me over reving it. Shitheads, a new belt shouldn't seize even when running at 9000 rpm and certainly not after 3000km. I'm allmost sure they didn't change the spanners. Gonna go talk to them tomorrow but me pretty furious with this kinda shit.
Just got pretty pissed and had to spit out the shite feeling.

Regards! Paul D.
Hoping to get it ready again for two meetings comming....

[ZeNiTh-PbArM]

hi.

you can't have over-revved the engine since the 16V has motronic, hence a rev limiter that cuts-off spark and fuel above a certain rpm (i think i's around 7000rpm but can't tell the value for sure).
normally, the engine can mechanically withstand very high revs, i saw a carbed 33 1.7 8V once over-rev on a track to the end of the scale(!) without damaging anything.
so the bastards who did replace the belts are probably the culprits in your case. unfortunately, repairs can cost a huge amount of money (bent valves, dead lifters, perhaps bent rods plus bearings, gaskets, new belts ; and the additional labour cost (getting the head off, lapping valves...) so this explains why the garage doesn't want to think about it.

good luck in your quest for repairs.
regards,
zp

[RFlower]

Hi Paul D

Did the garage really replace the belts, and do you have that in writing ?

Maybe they did not change them, or did not do it correctly - check tensioner adjustment on the good belt, and condition of tensioner bearings. Are the tensioners locked as they should be ?

Suggest you have someone to witness removing the belts, check their condition, they should look like new after 3,000 K, if not, have someone like an auto club engineer give you a written opinion on their age, condition, etc., to substantiate any claim you make.

Then get legal advice - also try auto club, or consumer protection etc.

Good luck
_________________
Dick Flower, Nr. Carcassonne. '94 Trofeo 1.4 ie (F), '93 Imola 1.3/1.4 ie (now for breaking) (F), '91 1.7 ie (GB)(spare car), '86 Sprint 1.5 QV (F). '87 VW Syncro camper (F), '73 NSU Ro80 (F), '99 Fiat Seicento (F)

[alfistjen]

As they know that I studied automotive engineering they know they don't have to try anything on that matter. Checked everything and it's a spanner that was blown into pieces so the belt ran off. As I have on paper that the belt had been replaced 3000 km's ago, plus the fact that he told me the spanners weren't replaced because the don't wear out (they have several 33's with spanners working good at 300.000km too), so they blocked themselves into a waranty case.
Whole engine will be fixed and delivered back for all together 0€'s, big relief for me. Don't think they'll risk not replacing the spanners ever again.

Regards!

A reliefed and happy Paul

[Matt Stolton]

Always replace the tensioners.

It takes very little extra time and money, but saves a lot of damage and aggravation.

9 times out of 10, of all the cambelt failures I've seen Lloyd working on at Clovertech, it has been caused/accellerated by worn bearings in the tensioners. You can hear them rumbling when they come off these dead engines, or in bad cases, visibly see them wobbling.

If anyone has tried to turn a single camshaft against the buckets/valves/springs you will understand the load the belt is under. Then add a second camshaft, and try and do it at high speeds,and you wonder how the belts last five minutes.
_________________
Regards

Matt

Ex Alfa 33 'GTA' (P4 with Knobs On)
Now cruising in a 166 3.2 Ti!!

[Harri]

I have saan a couple of cases: one 33 16V and one 166TS (luckily only the balancer shaft tightener pulley in the 166) and in both cases the Japanese NTN bearings were fine but the made in Canada plastic wheel around the bearing had cracked into pieces! Definately they need to be changed at 60k kms the latest (probably better at 50k) at least in cold climates like here in Finland due to the big temperature differences of a hot (+90) and cold (-30) engine which make plastic brittle.

[RFlower]

Has anyone tried machining up metal tensioner pulleys?
_________________
Dick Flower, Nr. Carcassonne. '94 Trofeo 1.4 ie (F), '93 Imola 1.3/1.4 ie (now for breaking) (F), '91 1.7 ie (GB)(spare car), '86 Sprint 1.5 QV (F). '87 VW Syncro camper (F), '73 NSU Ro80 (F), '99 Fiat Seicento (F)

[alfistje]

don't know if you'd really need metal ones, replacing them everytime with the belts and placing good quality (gates grip kits etc...) should do the job I suppose.
In my case there wasn't much turing and hearing the bearing to do, the pulley had shattered into pieces totally.... didn't look to good.

Regards!

Paul D.