Alfa Pages

[Charlie]

i have the engine out of the car now. I have to say it was quite a squeeze getting the old bugger out. For some reason the shaft that connects the engine to the gearbox was about an inch too long so improvisation took place and we had to cut one of the bolts to lever her up enough not to bend the front crossmember. Also had to take off the centre pulley wheel. Still its out. Pressure washed it up and it looks awesome. I think I am gonna piant the block red and maybe the cylinder heads blue or matt black. not sure yet, maybe silver. While its out i am gonna sandblast the plenum cause some fool painted it with non heat proof silver spray and it looks tatty.

Any idea where i can get some coloured red hose. Only doing this because my dad has purple ones on his TVR Griff 500. You can see piccys if these interest you at www.greenbear.org.uk also he has very tuned engine.

Any how the real issue is my engine. I have opened her up, and have the horror of 6 bent valves and two sorry looking ones . Also my grease monkey mechanic mate assures me the valve sleeves have been damaged. I have sourced a new cylinder head from Ian at alfa salv. Is this a good idea. I not paying too mcuh for it hopefully but will it match up to the rest of the engine etc etc. I plan to rebuil the whole lot. It looks as if it has been apart before as the bores of the cylinder have been bored out. Would this mean my car has over sized pistons in it or ios this just a procedure to get rid of glazing in the bores. Not sure. The pistons seem a bit slack in the bore though. Not much but a bit. Also the tensioner pulley wheels are a bit sorry for themselves. So i have sourced new belts, new cylinder head, new gaskets, new tensioner wheels. Is there any thing else i should plan for whilst the block is out. Perhaps a new clutch?

Also is there any thing i should do to the engine bay whilst its clear, tidy it up and reseal it maybe? I am just thinking of the future and want to not have to fart about in there in a years time.

Also i am thinking of getting some lumpy cams for some more power/torqu. Can anyone reccomend decent ones.

Also the front brake dics are shot, am fitting tarox sport japan discs, are these any good, with Ferodo ds200 pads. Will this combo work?

Oh and on the previous topic of tools i have a nice set of Clarke tools from machine mart. dunno how good these are but the box is red and i have slapped a big alfa sticker on top. Essential. My mechanic uses snap on stuff i think. I had the pleasure of using all his quality tools when undoing my engine. impact sockets are good to crack off the bolts and undo any thing in seconds when accompanied by an air system. Its just quality.


Any how enough of the essay,

Suggestions much appreciated
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Charlie

Spaghetti and Meatballs

33 16v elegante

[Admin]

Hi

Would think about checking the clutch and changing it if worn. I would be tempted to replace the clutch release bearing anyway (that always seems to be what fails on 33 clutches). Might also be tempted with the water pump.

Not sure of any changes in the heads, but the cams did change. Probably best to stick to your old cams.

All the best

Keith

[Scott Sander]

Hi,

Which way did you take the engine out Dropping it or up thru the bonnet? Did you remove the gearbox and engine in one assembly

Consider replacing clutch, water pump, have a look at the welsh/core plugs, bottom end bearings, rings. Inspect the pistons for cracks, etc

I wouldn't paint the heads.

I'll have a look tonight for the gap limit between the piston and cylinder for you.
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Scott Sander
'91 Alfa 33 Boxer 16V Monza - Awesome
http://www.sanderfamily.com

[Charlie]

We took the engine up and out thru the top of the bonnet. We removed the bonnet, and all engine mounts, although i think the main one at the front at the bottom ahd perished, this need replacing. We undid all the bolts on the clutch housing and tried levering the lump out. This was not happening as the gearbox needed to go back a few inches. We then undid the mount for the gearbox which is on the bottom of the roll bar/strut brace then the gearbox could be pushed back a couple of inches. This was not enough as the shaft was still in place in the gearbox assembly. I think we had to cut one of the top bolts which looked like it had been put back ion the wrong way. Was atr the top near the same top geatrbox housing. This gave enough clearance to get it out to a point then the middle pulley wheel was fouling slightly so we removed it. Oh the joys. I dunno whether this was the right method , but we were already in head first. Its out now any how.

I shant paint the heads then, but can i paint the block? power steering fluid is black. Is this a sign of broken pump or summit worse. I think the clutch is looking a bit sorry for itself. May as well change it. As for the size of the cylinders etc that would be very helpful.
May be just the excuse for those oversize pistons and a rebore. He he.

Cheers
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Charlie

Spaghetti and Meatballs

33 16v elegante

[Scott Sander]

Hi,

Normally, drop the engine out the bottom, while the gearbox is still attached, Then remove the gearbox. To remove the gearbox with the engine attached, you undo the drive shafts (tie them up with a bit of wire to stop them from flopping around) and the selector linkage and there you have it. Also have to undo some of the lower control arms before dropping the motor. This is my preferred method.

You car most likely does not have A/C. So removing the front cross member would not be a problem.

Maybe worth considering when reinstalling. But you would have to remove the gearbox to do it; I guess that is still attached to the chassis.

Painting the motor is recommended. Just a can of engine spray paint from your local auto shop. I replaced the welsh plugs on my motor so we taped them over so they would not get painted. Looked good.

Try flushing the PS system once the engine is back in the car. It is most likely just old fluid.
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Scott Sander
'91 Alfa 33 Boxer 16V Monza - Awesome
http://www.sanderfamily.com

[Charlie]

I did suggest that to my mechanic, dropping the whole lot out the bottom. However he assured me he didnt want to make unnecesary work for himself. He is obviously not italian minded. I will aquire some welsh/core plugs then? are these expensive. I assume it will be easier to put the engine in the way we took it out then? but in future i will drop it out the bottom. Did you manage to find out the distance between cylinder and piston. This would be very useflu. I imagine there should be a certain slackness to allow for expansion when hot. Maybe i am being paranoid but it has definitly had a rebore as there is corss scoring noticable on the lining of the bore. I fancy fitting some heat reflective sheeting on the inside of the engine bay and also heat sheilding the exhaust manifolds. Is this necesarry. I also plan to fabricate a cold air feed to the cone filter i have fitted. What is the best way of doing this. Is it just a simple case of fitting a length of tubing from the somewhere in the front bumber to where the filter is sat?



Cheers so far
i will keep you updated
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Charlie

Spaghetti and Meatballs

33 16v elegante

[Gary UK]

Put the engine back in by moving the car over the engine and lowering it (the car) down. You will need to remove the front cross member (and attach it to the engine) to do this, well this is how I have done it previously.

[Scott Sander]

Hi,

I would still be tempted to remove the gearbox. But it's really up to you. Good luck if you put it back in thru the top.

More work well, I would say it is harder to pull the motor out and back in thru the top, than droping the engine/gearbox out the bottom.

You don't have to replace the welsh/core plugs. Not essential unless they look in bad shape, but this will be the easiest time to do them, same goes with the clutch, water pump, etc

Measurements Will send myself an email to remind me.
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Scott Sander
'91 Alfa 33 Boxer 16V Monza - Awesome
http://www.sanderfamily.com

[rjbevan]

Hi Charlie, you said "Maybe I am being paranoid but it has definitly had a rebore as there is cross scoring noticable on the lining of the bore". If this is the case then the piston rings haven't bedded in. The bore should be nice and smooth. I was always told to use normal oil (i.e. nothing special) after an engine rebuild so that the rings could bed in. Do you know the pedigree of your engine?

All the best with the rebuild.

Richard

[Charlie]

The bores are very smooth. However it is clear that re boring has talen place becasue as the light catches the sides of the bore the lines are noticable, but to the touch they are as smooth as you like. Still a bit worried about the play in the pistons though.

The engine itself has done a good 108 thousand miles. However she is in fine fettle other than the bent valve/camshaft disaster. I always use the Alfa romeo specific Selenia motor oil recommended by alfa aid. Nothing but the best.

Still this weekend is the one where i get all the parts and can start working out the jigsaw puzzle again. He he.

Cheers for all the advice.
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Charlie

Spaghetti and Meatballs

33 16v elegante

[Admin]

Hi

The cross hatching is normal. If the bores are totally smooth then they will not hold oil, resulting in major rapid engine wear. This is why bores are honed. To provide a very slightly rough surface to retain the oil

All the best

Keith

[Scott Sander]

Hi,

The clearance between cylinders and pistons is 0.04 - 0.06mm.

To do this you need to measure the diameter of the piston and the cylinder and calculate the clearance. You will need to remove the piston to do this.
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Scott Sander
'91 Alfa 33 Boxer 16V Monza - Awesome
http://www.sanderfamily.com

[Charlie]

Cheers for the figures i will check it out over the weekend hopefully. All of the bits are arriving this weekend. i am really excited

thanks for all the advice
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Charlie

Spaghetti and Meatballs

33 16v elegante