Alfa Pages

Brit01 · Gold Cloverleaf Joined: 24 May 2010 Posts: 665

Going for the NOS cam supports. Early Christmas present!! Lol

So new cams/tappets and NOS cam supports! Nice...
_________________
S2 33 1988 1.7 QV
Dellorto DRLA40 (32mm venturi)

Brit01 · Gold Cloverleaf Joined: 24 May 2010 Posts: 665

Change of plan for the moment.

I had the used cam box measured accurately and surprisingly it's all within specs and no lateral wear. backlash: 0.050 - 0.058 mm

So... I will try this one out first before forking out a ton load of cash for NOS parts.

[url]

Uploaded with ImageShack.us[/url]

[url]

Uploaded with ImageShack.us[/url]
_________________
S2 33 1988 1.7 QV
Dellorto DRLA40 (32mm venturi)

ZeNiTh-PbArM · Posted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 11:03 pm Post subject:

Hi,

Did you check a few things :
- ticking noise can be caused by oil pressure not getting to the tappet ; did you check for clogged oil ways in the cam box?
- are you positive the noise is indeed due to cam/follower backlash? Other possibilities are piston slap in cylinder (usually more noise when cold), backlash between piston and conrod, or leaky exhaust at the cylinder head to manifold junction.

If you suspect cam boxes, one solution is to swap parts between left & right cylinder banks and see if the noise changes side or not.

regards,
zp

Brit01 · Gold Cloverleaf Joined: 24 May 2010 Posts: 665

Thanks for the suggestions/advice.

Yes everything has been checked thoroughly (assistance with Guy Croft), and we are 95% sure it's the worn bucket causing loss of oil pressure in this one even with new tappets.

Time will tell. Hopefully get the head back on this weekend and test.

This bucket was particularly worn, oval and way out of tolerance.

Piston slap and worn shells have a distintive sound and different timing.
Also we pulled the plugs while idling (this would reduce the sound if it was a small end shell).

Tick tick tick ONLY when engine gets hot and in the bucket that was most worn/oval.

Silent when cold.
_________________
S2 33 1988 1.7 QV
Dellorto DRLA40 (32mm venturi)

RFlower · Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 12:31 pm Post subject:

I am a little puzzled by what you mean by “bucket”.

To me a bucket is part of the hydraulic lifter, but you say these are all new, so how can a new bucket be worn, oval and out of tolerance?

I thought maybe you meant the bore in the cam box in which the lifter runs, but you already said the cam box has been measured accurately and is all within specs….
_________________
Dick Flower, Nr. Carcassonne. '94 Trofeo 1.4 ie (F), '93 Imola 1.3/1.4 ie (now for breaking) (F), '91 1.7 ie (GB)(spare car), '86 Sprint 1.5 QV (F). '87 VW Syncro camper (F), '73 NSU Ro80 (F), '99 Fiat Seicento (F)

Brit01 · Gold Cloverleaf Joined: 24 May 2010 Posts: 665

Sorry bore yes.

The cylinder/bore that the tappet fits into is worn and oval.
Obviously tilting as it bottoms out and loosing it's pressure.

The used one I sourced is within specs and not oval at all.
_________________
S2 33 1988 1.7 QV
Dellorto DRLA40 (32mm venturi)

RFlower · Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 3:01 pm Post subject:

Brit01 · Gold Cloverleaf Joined: 24 May 2010 Posts: 665

ah my apologies. Using 4 forums at once - lol

Yes sourced an old one, been sitting around for years, but after cleaning a lot, dishwasher etc lol

it came out nice.

Lets see if it holds the pressure in the new tappets better,

[url]

Uploaded with ImageShack.us[/url]

[url]

Uploaded with ImageShack.us[/url]
_________________
S2 33 1988 1.7 QV
Dellorto DRLA40 (32mm venturi)

RFlower · Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 4:50 pm Post subject:

Brit01 · Gold Cloverleaf Joined: 24 May 2010 Posts: 665

Yes it was a big mistake not to measure the bores with a micrometer and check for lateral wear. Never skimp on measuring and measuring again.
1-2 thou can make a difference.

Yes I agree with mechanical tappets 100%.

One day I will convert it. New heads, faster cams and mech tappets for sure with the accessible cam box with 4 screws on top.

I HATE the alfa cam box with the hydraulic tappets. Whole head needs to come off, new head gasket, drain water, exhaust manifold off, everything.

PITA.

Here you can see the old bore with wear below and above the oil hole.
[url]

Uploaded with ImageShack.us[/url]
_________________
S2 33 1988 1.7 QV
Dellorto DRLA40 (32mm venturi)

RFlower · Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 5:33 pm Post subject:

Brit01 · Gold Cloverleaf Joined: 24 May 2010 Posts: 665

Brit01 · Gold Cloverleaf Joined: 24 May 2010 Posts: 665

Yess my gasket set has finally arrived - now full steam ahead. (and no ticking hopefully!!)
_________________
S2 33 1988 1.7 QV
Dellorto DRLA40 (32mm venturi)

BigAl · P4 Joined: 06 May 2003 Posts: 2990 Location: U.K Surrey

Good luck Brit Smile

Hope it all goes well Smile

_________________
x2 33 16v
pictures http://www.alfa-pages.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=5203

Brit01 · Gold Cloverleaf Joined: 24 May 2010 Posts: 665

Cheers mate.

Also going for a new radiator tomorrow.
My old bent copper one had seen it's days I think. Weighs a ton and a half and is slightly bent.

Damaged in one accident and is probably over 2 decades old now.

Going to try out one of the modern plastic/aluminium radiators.
_________________
S2 33 1988 1.7 QV
Dellorto DRLA40 (32mm venturi)

Brit01 · Gold Cloverleaf Joined: 24 May 2010 Posts: 665

Good progress done this weekend.

All assembled - first heat cycle completed.
Re-retorqued day after on Sunday and checked oil/water levels. All good.
New Bosch cap and rotor installed.
Also NEW fusebox lid!! Rare item.

Ran it up to temp again today, radiator worked nicely and NO TICKING!!!
Got to give it some testing on the highways this week to see if all is ok.
Unfortunately the microphone is bad on the camera and echoes in the garage - sounds much smoother believe me

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J2v0z85Mlmo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UlY4YKMLrX8
_________________
S2 33 1988 1.7 QV
Dellorto DRLA40 (32mm venturi)

BigAl · P4 Joined: 06 May 2003 Posts: 2990 Location: U.K Surrey

Wahoo, well done bud Smile

_________________
x2 33 16v
pictures http://www.alfa-pages.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=5203

Brit01 · Gold Cloverleaf Joined: 24 May 2010 Posts: 665

No I can't remember what it should sound like or sounded like before.

Definitely no ticking now. After a hard 30km highway run and fan kicking in when I entered the parking lot (hot engine), I opened up the bonnet and no ticking. I guess all is normal now Rolling Eyes

I plan to change the other cam box also as it had lateral wear.

Very Happy

I will try and upload a better video this week. I tried last night in the garage but there was so much echo it sounded bad.

New aluminium radiator brings the temp down to 82 quickly but I have a 90/80 sensor and I think I could do with a 82/83 sensor. I don't need the temp to fall below 82-80.

I've heard of 87/83 ones but haven't found one yet.

Mine is M22 with 2 x 6.3 connectors.

Any suggestions?
_________________
S2 33 1988 1.7 QV
Dellorto DRLA40 (32mm venturi)

gritsop · Posted: Tue Oct 11, 2011 9:55 pm Post subject:

Nice to see your efforts paid back!

Now that you have reached the end of the rebuilt, why dont you make a step-by-step manual and post it on www.alfa-restoration.co.uk Wink

regards
_________________
Thanassis Gritsopoulos
1991 Alfa 33 1.4 IE
2001 Alfa 147 1.6 Distinctive

http://www.alfa-restoration.co.uk
Parts Shop: www.alfa-restoration.co.uk/shop

Brit01 · Gold Cloverleaf Joined: 24 May 2010 Posts: 665

Not at the end of the road yet my friend.

Now my lambda sensor and gauge are giving me incorrect readings.
It will occasionally give me the correct AFR of about 13.5 then shoot off the scale to 20+ and start flashing.

If the sensor was faulty they told me if would show a 3.

Could be an air leak. I changed the gaskets on the manifold tonight - no change!!! Confused

Could be a hairline crack on the 2-1 weld I guess. I did spot a pinhole on the left weld!!

Put some duck tape on it and started it up cold - still no correct reading.
Maybe a bigger hole where I can't see.

Tech support advised me to clean the Bosch lambda - could be dirty!
_________________
S2 33 1988 1.7 QV
Dellorto DRLA40 (32mm venturi)

Brit01 · Gold Cloverleaf Joined: 24 May 2010 Posts: 665

Very bad news Mad

Ticking is back, same place also.

What now?

Leaking exhaust manifold or small end bearing to look at at?

Can a small end bearing sound similar to a ticking tappet?
Goes away when revved.

BUT when I brake under compression in gear I sometimes get a rattle. No knocking but rattling!!
This has been present for a long time.

getting a fellow 33 fanatic to check the noises on Sunday.

So annoying as it went away for a short while.

This is some dark area staining around the flange/exhaust manifold under piston 3. Maybe a distorted flange.
Trying to eliminate possibilities as chances are it being a tappet now are remote IMHO.
_________________
S2 33 1988 1.7 QV
Dellorto DRLA40 (32mm venturi)

paulhide · Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2011 3:31 pm Post subject:

Surely you would be able to feel any exhaust gases escaping around the manifold gasket area with your hand, whilst the engine was running? (being careful not to burn yourself)
_________________
Owner's Club 33 Registrar. Now from P4 & S2 1.7 QV
http://www.alfa-pages.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=5188

Bobkelso · Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2011 3:34 pm Post subject:

Hi, your work on that motor and the explanation and photos you are posting are very good.
And for me it is not only usefull, but interesting,
I read it day by day as a novel for motorhead people ' Shocked

'
For your last post:

- in a motor just rebuild, so all clean, probably the "dark area staining around
the flange/exhaust manifold under piston 3" is a crear indication
something to look at first of all other ipotesis

- one time I had some strange problems of my carb 33 going
differently day bay day, varing fuel consume, exaust Co,
and rumor/vibration of the motor (going 3 and 1/2 ),
like a valve/hydraulic lifter was non perfect sometimes,
it was old ignition cables leaking but very little, not evident,
and no one I asked founded the problem, until I read in a forum
that the only way to discover that weak electric leaking was looking
at the cables with the idling motor in the night in an area non urban,
with very low lights, possibly in a night with hy humidity;
Few fugitive blu sparkles where there!!
_________________
Alfa 33

Brit01 · Gold Cloverleaf Joined: 24 May 2010 Posts: 665

Many thanks for your kind comments.

It is certainly a long adventure.

Spark is like a lightening strike.

New Bosch cap and rotor. Magnecore 8.5mm red cables.

If I remove one of them the spark can jump 3 inches - deep blue and makes a hell of a bang!!!

I just cleaned and all plugs and changed them around. Retarded ignition by 1 degree but no change at all.

I guess next purchase is a new manifold which has been on my list for a year.
Cross over in stainless steel.

Maybe I do have a distorted flange on piston 3.
_________________
S2 33 1988 1.7 QV
Dellorto DRLA40 (32mm venturi)

Brit01 · Gold Cloverleaf Joined: 24 May 2010 Posts: 665

also probably just coincidence with the oil filters.

I changed from Mann to Fiaam filter this oil change when the ticking started yesterday.
This shouldn't have anything to do with it no?
_________________
S2 33 1988 1.7 QV
Dellorto DRLA40 (32mm venturi)